12-1-04 through 12-7-04

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

This thread is for feedback and discussion of work distributed amongst the Algonquin Round Table between December 1st, 2004 and December 7th, 2004

The pieces in question are :

Viper in my Bosom Act 3- From TJAman
Untitled Screenplay - CrazyGolfa
Buffy Random Story Generator - Charisma69


If you would like to be added to the roles of the illustrious Algonquin Round Table in order to be able to submit and receive Round Table works in progress, please contact Py, who will probably just add your name to the roster without any bruhaha whatsoever.

[tjaman]

c'golfa: I just read "Untitled," and there's a couple of comments, but first what you asked for: spellings and punctuation.

There are a couple with the waitress: "Perv" is misspelled, and there's a stray period in the "Hooters" line. Otherwise, pretty clean.

Now for the unsolicited stuff and feel free to ignore it:

I don't have any immediate interest in either of these people, but it's possible casting could change that. As it is, their game, their bet, the bar, Steve's gropery ("pulling an Arnold" is going to get really obscure really fast; just mentioning it) -- it just seems so banal that I really didn't feel too much for them, sorry.

It wasn't until the murder that the story took on a sort of David Lynch "Lost Highway" sort of vibe. But still, basically, some drunken yutz I haven't established many feelings for is killed, and the only person I'm feeling anything for, really, is his mom.

I'd script the conversation with Steve's mom, and open a better window on the Joe-Steve relationship -- especially since there's no more Steve, really, after his death.

Without you doing something clever and nonlinear, that is.

It reads like a script that meets the requirements of a scriptwriting assignment. I wasn't convinced that it was going to be followed up and submitted, or that even you had a lot invested in it. It read sketchy.

But then, I don't write screenplays. I imagined the settings they were in and I could see it on television, but kind of like a "Hart to Hart" episode. I don't know why that's what came to mind, but it did.

And I could be completely looped.

I'd narrow Eliza's reading material to a single identifiable title -- our introduction and reaction to Eliza is going to be different if she's reading, say, "Shakespeare's Tragedies," "MacBeth," "Romeo & Juliet," "A Midsummer Night's Dream" or "Much Ado About Nothing." Hell, all of that is different from us meeting her reading, "Shakespeare's Sonnets." Decide who she is and decide what that person would be reading and the introduce her as such.

The only thing we know about her before we meet her is that Steve -- some random, aging adolescent who's on the screen -- disapproves of her impact on his friendship with Joe, and we get a sense of Joe's devotion to her.

Introducing Steve and Joe on the greens was a pretty good introduction, but I honestly don't know much about them. What I do know is that they're vulgar in the way 20somethings can be, that Joe's seems to be the responsible one (and also seems reasonably conflicted about something), Steve seems to be the crass, drunken, booty-grabbing one, and that they're reasonably good friends (and we have almost no backstory on their friendship and the nature of it -- how long have they been friends, do they work together, how often do they get together, etc. etc.) with some unreadable tension that we get a window on with the Eliza passages.

It's a good basic skeleton, but I'd want to get a lot more meat on these bones if I was gonna plunk down and watch it.

[TheMasterGeek]

Thanks for the honesty. The problem is that this only supposed to be first 10 pages of the script, which equals about 10 minutes of screen time in a 2 hr movie, so there may be not enough character development for the first few minutes. I still got 20 more pages for the assignment. So it will might be some more development on the characters. I have a few more characters to introduce.

We will meet Eliza's dad in the future, an ally of Joe.

There will be tension between Eliza and Joe. within the next 20 pages.

There will be a flashback where we see Joe and Steve as teenagers.

I will write the next 10 pages tonite, and the last 10 pages tommorrow.

The working title is "Out of Bounds"

[tjaman]

That helps a lot. An overall structure of the piece is helpful.

That being said, it's too bad the 20 pages have to be from the beginning. The introduction is often less lively than specific points of conflict (not that a murder is not inherently interesting).

Of course, some introductory sequences are perfect: Witness "Desperate Housewives." We have a suicide in the first two minutes and the entire neighborhood coming in for the wake in the next eight -- a perfect introduction to about 80 percent of the major players in the series.

I forgot to mention keep up the good work. Like everything else, writing gets better with practice.

[TheMasterGeek]

The ten pages could have been from any point, but I choose the beginning because it was easier. The only requirement that it need 24-26 pages of new material. I alread had 6 pages finished.

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

OK- Much delayed thanks to stupid work, and possibly no longer relevant- But here goes-

CrazyGolfa-

I really liked the initial premise. I've got a question about the intended tone however. Right now it could be played just about any which way. Judging by your comments earlier, are you going in a 'black comedy' sort of direction?

If so I would slightly change the cut between Joe's line about nothing can happen to him and jump cut faster to the police tape being set up, then back to Joe safely in bed, enjoying some bliss, then back to the body. A little more stark contrast might make it play grimmer and funnier. Perhaps a shot of Steve with Joe's club sticking out of his head? (or perhaps you want to save the reveal of the impliment of death- that's pretty much a structural choice.)

I might have someone else on the golf course for the soul purpose of hearing Joe threaten to kill Steve- Ratchet up the tension later on with that.

In a film media- Don't be afraid to jump cut a bit more for the sake up setting up atmosphere- I'd have at least a shot or two of Eliza at the very beginning counterpointing the two playing golf- These can also be played for a bit of a laugh as well as getting the audience set up for Eliza';s existence. Perhaps you could also use these to set up whether or not she actually IS a bitch, as she is later accused This will help gloss over the moments where you describe that they talk, but don't say anything in detail about what they say.

SPeaking of- Those sections are a good opportunity to inject some humor, if that's what you're still looking for. A little playful interaction between the two to get a sense on things, you know.

All in all, I really like the basic structure and setup- curious to know where it's going. Is ELiza really a bitch? Did Joe do it? Is Joe ALWAYS that much of a jerk?

You've got my interest, and that's a good thing

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

And on to TJ's Viper Act III-

I really enjoy the whole feel of this play- very high farce with lots of lovely misunderstanding and miscommunication. you're right however that it does get very confusing to read

A few thoughts on formatting that might help to clarify it: I'd always refer to the character's by their actual name, then in parentheses if they are speaking as a character within the play - This will help a lot in keeping which production is which straight, which kept confusing me (ALthough in a production of course this would be entirely visual and work just fine on its own)

Also, for the sake of easier reading, you might want to start putting stage directions in Italics. It'll help keep people's head in the piece while they're reading it.

I still love all the conceits that you've got going on here-
That Carla has somehow managed to be in both shows- that Cameron and his mother STILL haven't figured out that they're both doing the same production, despite the fact that they are apparently sharing a ticket booth- All good.

And a classic ending to the act, farce wise, of the set collapsing and an awkward bow.

I like the passive agressive way that Cameron is dealing with them altering his play. And I'm really enjoying the differences between the two productions Beautiful touch that Alan feels compelled to laugh at all of his inserted laugh lines.

On to Act IV for me then

[tjaman]

Your comments, Py, are always relevant.

Even when they are irreverent, loopy, totally off the mark (which, given their unquestionable relevance, is quite a feat , or when they drag the conversation in a direction that perhaps some of us were thinking, but you come right out and post.

That is, indeed, part of their wonderfulness. ;D

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

YOU, TJ, are going to give me a big head

But thank you very much, all the same.

I feel the same about your commentary, as you durn well know.

[tjaman]

And again you prove my point. Thank you, Py.

The one redirect I'd give (and thank you for the structural comments -- I think I did go to the trouble of italicizing when I sent out Act 4) is that in a civic auditorium in a small midwestern town, the adjoining rooms would have different entrances and a little table outside where tickets were being taken. At least, that's how it is in ours. But hand gestures by the actors on stage indicating where they think their tickets are being taken could help the audience out.

Thank you, as always.

[TheMasterGeek]

The film is actually a suspense story, with bits of comedy sprinkled throughout the film.

My teacher said, I didnt have any stage directions, because it would clutter the script.

The FBI is setting up Joe for the murder. And other stuff which is revealed in the next 20 pages.

I should sent it out to you guys soon.

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

Cool- Can't wait to read further.

TJ-- You're always already on top of whatever I suggest, durn it.

[PyleansDontLeaveMe]

Here is what the random story generator came up with for me -

The Willow staked over any bored Gentleman.
- They did look bored, didn't they? You go Willow!

No Giles jumped under one bored Vampire.
- True. Giles is not the kind of man to just climb under any old vampire just because he's cold and lonely. That's Buffy's Job. (OH NO HE Di-int!)

An Oz walked from an stuffy Sunnydale.
- Sadly true. That episode still makes me cry.

An Cordelia jumped from some bruised Demon.
- True. But more common that Cordy jumped ON some bruised demon and ended up pregnant. (ON NO HE DI-INT!)

One Spike fought from the bruised Caleb.
- Oddly enough, an adequate review of Dirty Girls.

Some Willow killed from an stuffy Sunnydale.
- And one of Two to Go.

One Spike ran over some evil Vampire.
- Because he was too busy singing and couldn't see out the windshield.

Some Spike hit to an stuffy Faith.
- And then they had a cigarette.

Any Xander jumped from the bruised Vampire.
- Many many times.

One Buffy killed at the big Vampire.
- Again, Many many times

Some Willow killed on no hot Vampire.
- Was it evil willow? Was it Vampire Willow? Was it Season One Willow? We'll never know!

No Oz ran at no pretty Master.
- Because he wasn't created until at least four episodes later.

An Giles fought on any bruised Caleb.
- Really Giles. Focus on the significant Caleb.

One Willow staked over no big Master.
- Because she was at the prom, if I remember rightly.

No Spike staked on some big Master.
- Because he also was not created for another three episodes.

Some Buffy walked at some stuffy Faith.
- Quite menacingly. And wearing leather pants.

Some Buffy staked to one bored Vampire.
- A fair few times.

Some Willow staked on an stuffy Master.
- Was it evil WIllow? Was it Vampi...

No Buffy jumped to some pretty Faith.
- However much crazygolfa hoped it would happen on screen

No Cordelia ran around a bruised Vampire.
- Nope. She ran right through 'em.



I love this story generator. I may never get actual work done again

[tjaman]

That's exactly the sort of thing I was hoping to read -- if I could've made the blorry thing work. Thanks for including a few examples, Py. Those were fun. ;D